Making money from origami - ethics?

[Unmutual]

Specifically: would it be ethically correct for me to make and sell completed, folded origami models which I did not design. I would credit the original designer.

On the one hand, I could frame it as people paying me for my time - they don't have the ability to make complex models, but I do. On the other - I wouldn't want to make money by ripping off/cheating artists I admire.

Is there a protocol for this? Or even a legal position? Should I write individually to artists whose work I wanted to recreate, or is this purely a matter of me and my conscience?

I'm not sure what's right here. Thoughts?

[Baltorigamist]

I think it depends on the area as far as what the specific laws are.

As far as I know, you're not allowed to sell something designed by somebody else without the designer's permission (whether you credit them or not). Contact the artists in question and work out something. (They may allow you to on the condition that you give them some of your profit, or they may not let you sell their work at all.)

[FlareglooM]

I don't know about a protocol, but in my opinion you should do the following: contact the designer of the model and ask them if are allowed to do that or not. I wouldn't be surprised if some designers will allow you to sell their models, of course with crediting them. But just to be sure ask them, then you are always on the right side

[kareshi]

As far as I understand it, it's legal but unethical. Last I read from Origami USA was you can sell a model from somebody else's design if you're not using the creator's name for personal gain... whatever that means.

[steingar]

If one examines the rather voluminous US copyright statues, one will not find the word "Origami". Isn't there. Therefore, there is no statute outlining the legality or lack thereof in the sale of unoriginal origami models. On clearly cannot copy and distribute diagrams, but there is no guidance vis-a-vis sale of models.

We can then turn of precedent, or the case law surrounding Origami. Unsurprisingly, there is none. Robert Lang and associates now have a case against the famed artist Sara Morris that is the first that I know of .

The problem comes in when we consider application. If you publicly perform a protected piece of music, you must pay royalties to the music's author or agents thereof. However, you can build a sailboat from copyright protected plans and sell it. So, is Origami music or sailboat? That is for a judge to decide. Since none have done so, there exists no prohibition against selling origami models, even ones you didn't design.

[jeko]

The legal position is only part of the equation. Given that the origami community is fairly small it is not unlikely that you will meet the artist personally at some point. I am pretty sure I would feel bad in a situation where I'm meeting the artist whose work I've previously sold without asking permission (whether or not s/he is aware of the fact).

[steingar]

There I take a slightly different and more personal tack. Yes, someone else designed the piece. Odds are a paid them good money for it. They did not create, decorate, or select the paper I use to fold it. They didn't fold it. They didn't shape it, or frame it, if such is the case. If I create an Origami piece I am the artists, and I have no compunction to sell it, though I would try my best to credit the designer.

That's my own take. I don't know the everyone would agree, nor could I blame anyone for feeling differently. The law is relatively concrete. How anyone feels ethically is another matter.

[long_quach]

Put ethics aside for a moment. Has anybody really make any serious money out of origami? Tell us what you make and what you sell it for. That would be some good gossip around here. That, would be priceless.

[chesslo]

If serious money has been made, then Joseph Wu would know about it.

[phillipcurl]

I've made money off of selling origami, but no more than like $100 in total. so nothing serious.
I'm doing a show in a few weeks here in atlanta, and i'll be selling a koi pond, hopefully for upwards of $150.

[Joe the white]

I've been paid $160 for teaching traditional origami classes over the years, at about $40 per class. I've also sold a few models (some Harry Potter styled models), but most of it went to benefit the library I work for. For myself, I once sold a model to my aunt for $25. So, total lets say that comes to $185. That alone is at least a $800 profit "loss" in comparison to average rates that I could compare to.

If you take into account paper costs, time spent, education/expertise, and models and classes given for free, the profits would probably be in the negative by some thousands over the past 16 years .

The highest profit margin (unless you have some wealthy clients) would be in traditional models.
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Lets say you fold some models that take 3 minutes to fold each, and you rent a stall at a local flea market, and it is staffed by one person. This is your basic overhead costs:

Rent for the stall: $100 per month at my local market
Cost for 6 inch kami paper: about 5 cents per sheet
Cost for folding the origami based on 3 minutes at $7.50 per hr: 38 cents per origami
Cost to staff the booth: With hours of 10am-2pm two days a week for 4 weeks: $240 at $7.50 per hour

Total overhead: $340 per month and 43 cents per origami piece

To break even, you'd have to sell around 790 origami models that month (or about 25 models per working hour). If you up that to $1 in an attempt to make a profit of 57 cents per origami, at the same amount of models sold, you'd make about $450, and would have to sell 340 models to break even (or about 10 models per working hour). For some places in the country, even selling 10 simple models at $1 per might be difficult, let alone 25+.

By comparison, you could fold Robert Lang's Scorpion Varileg from Origamido paper, and even at minimum wage rates, you're looking at around a $45 investment before royalties (if he asks for them) and your attempt at a profit.

By nature origami isn't valued too highly by the general public, both because its seen as a school craft or simply because it is made of paper (something we use everyday, and is often highly disposable). Gimmicks or alternative media might be helpful, such as folding from metal mesh, or decorating the piece/arranging it in an interesting way (people might buy cranes for a wedding or origami as a centerpiece/flower arrangement). Giving the booth an asian or otherwise alluring style might also help to attract customers.