MC - Methyl Cellulose

zxop9 · Post by **zxop9** » October 15th, 2008, 12:43 am

i've folded a few things now out of the mc paper, it is over all better then tissue paper for folding imo, but i have one problem with it, the edges rip really easy, too easy in fact, sometimes when flattening a crease i push to hard and the edge rips. maybe i'm not putting enough mc on the edge as compared to the middle, but does anyone else have this problem?

pereze · Post by **pereze** » October 15th, 2008, 2:41 am

Tissue paper can vary significantly in thickness so it may be possible that the tissue paper you are using is thinner and weaker than others'. More importantly though, the quality of fiber used in generic tissue paper is very low and also may account for its delicate nature. Rather than using more MC, you may want to consider buying a different brand of tissue paper.

One last thing, are you using MC or a paste with MC as an ingredient? When I tried the later, I discovered that the edges of the paper cracked when I folded.

NickH · Post by **NickH** » October 16th, 2008, 6:56 am

I thought I'd share my experiences with "MC". I've been folding for about 6 years and have used the MC approach since Lang posted about it on the O-list some years ago. Usually it has been to stiffen or back coat unryushi which I find is great for complex models such as arthropods (mind you this wont do for most of Sirgo's insects)

For those of you having difficulty getting pure MC try wall-paper paste. I actually use Selleys wall-paper paste, which is a reputable Australian brand and is available in every hardware store. It behaves exactly like MC and is chemically almost identical (it contains some anti-mould agents and other trade secrets). That said I would love to hear if others have had a different experience with wall-paper paste. For small pieces ( up to 45cm) I use a horizontal piece of glass but for larger pieces (70 cm - 1.2 m) I have used a vertical glass sliding door. I have never measured my amounts but made up a roughly "snot" like consistecy (to quote Lang).

More recently, after having made some "Sirgo Paper" for his stick insect, I have converted to using PVA (Selley's Aquadhere:water 1:3) for sizing paper - especially Lokta (wich did not size well with MC). I find that PVA treated paper molds really well, much better than that treated with MC. This made shaping of kamiya's lion mane and Diaz's horse mane much easier, for example. If I shape/compress PVA treated paper I often also use "MC" and this gives really firm results for things such as bug legs and horses hooves - better than MC alone. For back coating I still use "MC".

Soon I'll post some pics to illustrate the above.

Visionary · Post by **Visionary** » October 16th, 2008, 9:24 am

I'm just pondering whether to begin using MC and after reading through this thread I have a very simple beginner question:

Once you have mixed the MC with water I read that it should be left alone for about a day. Then after you applied it to some tissue is it possible to keep the rest and reuse it later?

As the tissue needs about a day to dry and you probably don't need all of that mixed MC from half a liter of water for two sheets of tissue it would seem like a huge waste if you had to throw the rest away afterwards?

I think I even saw one picture somewhere in this thread of someone having a glass with a finished MC solution standing on their desk. How long can you keep it like that? Can you just add some more water after a few days/weeks to make it useable again?

origamimasterjared · October 16th, 2008, 9:42 am

Dude I've kept that stuff for months at a time.

floopate · Post by **floopate** » October 16th, 2008, 1:50 pm

i've kept my MC in an airtight container for oh... more than half a year now. it still seems to be pretty okay. so yeah, i guess you can keep it for a VERY loooooong time.

Post by **origami_8** » October 16th, 2008, 5:35 pm

We keep it in the refrigerator and it holds for a really looooong time. A jam glass is perfect to store it and you can mix the solution just by shaking

The solution in our refrigerator is far thicker than the one we actually use, so when we need it we only take out a bit and mix it with water to the consistency we want.

HankSimon · Post by **HankSimon** » October 16th, 2008, 11:27 pm

In the US, I've purchased MC from paint stores or hardware stores... as the predominant ingredient in wall paper paste.

When you store it, keep the container closed because the water will evaporate. You can continue to add water if that happens, but eventually I have diluted it too much to be useful.

Also, if you leave the container open, then mold or bacteria can grow in it and ruin it.

Otherwise, it keeps for a long time. And a little goes a long way.

- Hank Simon

iggy_spotter · Post by **iggy_spotter** » October 17th, 2008, 10:53 am

Hi NickH
I live in Australia and would love to give mc a try. Would you recommend me buying selley's wallpaper paste or pva? What about pva from other brands? what is the approximate cost and would i be able to get it from bunnings or big w? ?On Lang's website he also recommended starch based adhesives, does that mean clag would also be suitable? any answer would be much appreciated.
thanks

BluePaper · Post by **BluePaper** » October 17th, 2008, 4:08 pm

After I had done a bit of research, I found that Elmer's Art Paste is actually MC. Because I had an Art supply store near where I live, I found myself in a rather good supply, but after making some, I neglected to properly store it, so it eventually all just dried up. I now know better

paperz · Post by **paperz** » October 17th, 2008, 4:28 pm

Hi BluePaper,

That piece of news is music to my ears

Do you know if it can be bought at Michaels or ACMoore? Also, have you used it to make double tissue paper? Any information using this product would be of great help! Thanks in advance,
Paperz

BluePaper · Post by **BluePaper** » October 17th, 2008, 9:33 pm

I'm not sure, I din't get mine at michaels (but we do have one near where I live) Though I didn't check to see if they had it or not, I would assume that they probably do carry it. I don't know about ACMoore. It comes in a small, white, 2 oz. box and is used for paper mache (or at least thats what the box says) its pretty cheap, about $2.50 where I got it. Hope this helps and good luck finding some!

Visionary · Post by **Visionary** » October 27th, 2008, 7:19 pm

One more newbie question.. as I read a few times, that the glass surface of picture frames is particularly suited for MCing I wondered about two things:

1. Do you take the glass out of the frame, or do you just accept that MC might flow into the frame and ruin it?

2. How do you clean the glass (or any surface with MC on it) afterwards? Does it easily wash off with water considering its water-soluble?

Post by **origami_8** » October 27th, 2008, 7:28 pm

My friend and I are using a frame less picture frame (a wooden plate and a glass plate held together by metal clips), so we don't have the problem that the frame could be ruined and if it would be ruined, it wouldn't matter because we bought it especially for paper preparation. The MC can be easily removed with any kind of glass cleaning agent and kitchen paper but probably water would do as well, the question is more if you can remove the colour with water only (some tissue paper bleeds when made wet) but it's likely.

qtrollip · Post by **qtrollip** » October 27th, 2008, 7:39 pm

I always get creases in thin paper after brushing it with MC. Especially larger papers.
Any way to prevent this?
Thanx!