origami: art or mathematics?

[HankSimon]

Devil's Advocate -

If you consider geometry to be a science, Dr. Robert Lang to be a scientist, and Professor Erik Demaine, Ph.D. to be a scientist, et al... then there are clear aspects of Origami as rigorous, self-consistent, and as proveable as any other geometric proof.

If you consider sculptor Eric Joisel to have been an artist, architect Giang Dinh to be an artist, Dr. Saadya Sternberg to be an artist, and scientist Bernie Peyton, Ph.D. to be an artist, et al... then you have a mix of scientists who create works of art.

So is it a particle or a wave .... or is it a floor wax or a dessert topping...?

I like Combination, based on context and model ...

- Hank Simon

[Trouble]

i just answered undicided because i think it is a mixture of them all

[orislater]

same here

[Adam]

Devil's Advocate

I love that film.

snip

So basically you consider mathematics (or specifically geometry) a science, even though it technically speaking isn't²; just like in Origami, there is no empirical evidence gathered for the purpose of hypothesis testing.

Robert Lang is a physicist; does that make all of his work scientific?
Eric Joisel was an artist; does that mean he could not possibly conduct a scientific experiment?
I am an Economist; does that mean that I make wild assumptions about Origami and that people confuse my work with that of businessmen or think that what I do makes absolutely no sense? I certainly hope not!


² : Notice that labelling things as science does not mean that they're more useful or valuable; the term "science" is nowadays all too often used by pretentious people who want to sound more important than they really are. Mathematical tools are, for instance, extremely useful in my field of work, as opposed to, for example, chemistry.

[the modern einstein]

This is getting way off track. We are supposed to be discussing whether origami is a form of science/maths/whatever you want to call it, not the differences between science and maths. they are fairly closely related, anyhow, and I was just generalising, as it's easier to write a post, if I label this particular aspect of origami as science.

[Adam]

This is getting way off track. We are supposed to be discussing whether origami is a form of science/maths/whatever you want to call it, not the differences between science and maths. they are fairly closely related, anyhow, and I was just generalising, as it's easier to write a post, if I label this particular aspect of origami as science.

How can you discuss whether it belongs to science/mathematics/art when these terms are not defined correctly? My aim is to show that Origami cannot be a part of science, due to Mathematics' fundamentally unscientific nature.

Origami ∈ Mathematics
Mathematics ∉ Science
Origami ∉ Science.

[Nostalgic]

I was unaware he had passed away.

His models are so detailed and beautiful. May he rest in peace.

[HankSimon]

I'm an ACS card carrying Chemist, and I believe that Math follows the principles of testing via the scientific method for falsafiability of hypotheses.

The Pythagorean Theorem is a simple example and Kawasaki's theorems are a little more complex

And sometimes Origami can be fun... because Fire Pretty...

- Hank Simon

[the modern einstein]

Just what I needed. Hanksimon, you are quite correct.

[Adam]

I'm an ACS card carrying Chemist, and I believe that Math follows the principles of testing via the scientific method for falsafiability of hypotheses.

Please elaborate. What empirical evidence does the field of Mathematics use in hypothesis testing?

[HankSimon]

A*A + B*B = C*C Demonstrated by placing a 3" square perpendicular to a 4" square, with a 5" square diagonally touching the corners.

You'll have to look up Robert Lang's paper for the Origami proofs.

- Hank Simon

[gordigami]

Hazarding the risk of oversimplification, I would offer an opinion that origami is an art form, hobby and craft that incorporates elements of mathematics, and especially, geometry .
Anyone who has utilized Haga's , Kawasaki's, or Maekawa's theorems as a tool toward understanding origami would be obliged to admit benefit .
Regarding the slippery slope of Mathematics per se, I would have to defer to the expertise of Tom Hull, Erik Demaine, Robert Lang Et al .
To ( mis) quote George Orwell, " All origami is artful . But some origami is more artful than others ! "
Pretty much boils down to personal perspective ...
Bottom line, I don't really waste my time with these questions, but instead, simply enjoy origami as a worthwhile endeavor .

[LeafPiece]

I'm surprised that some people feel that craft is a negative thing; I haven't heard of that before. To me, art is sort of an umbrella term, and craft is simply a subset of art. If there's any distinction at all, I often think of craft as a 3-d type of art. I don't know whether I prefer to call origami craft or art, but it is definitely easier to tell people I am crafting than... folding paper, lol.

I think by definition mathematics is a science, and if you think of science as a process, statistical analysis and related math is a huge part of that process.
Also, there are a few colleges at my university, and one of them is the College of Science and Mathematics. Soooo, they are at least related enough to be the same college .

[Pop pop]

i hate it too man. my mom always talks to people and says, "yeah, he's the origami master" and they think 'oh how cute a 14 year old making paper toys ' then i show them and there like," O_O" then it starts all over again whenever my mom talks to someone else. so annoying.....

thats how i feel its worser since i am 2 years younger than you
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the movie Between the Fold says it a science of art and the art of science

[Adam]

I think by definition mathematics is a science, and if you think of science as a process, statistical analysis and related math is a huge part of that process.
Also, there are a few colleges at my university, and one of them is the College of Science and Mathematics. Soooo, they are at least related enough to be the same college .

NOPE. Why do you think there is this specific distinction between "Science" and "Mathematics"; why isn't it just called "College of Science" instead? I'm not saying they're unrelated, I'm saying that Mathematics is by definitionnot a science.