skill level
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skill level
is there any definite skill level standard in origami??i mean-any way to measure in say-numbers or letters?
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- Jonnycakes
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- Brimstone
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From OUSA website:
SIMPLE - Simple classes can be taken by anyone, even if you have never folded before.
LOW INTERMEDIATE - These classes are for folders who have done some folding, know some terminology and can do an inside reverse fold.
INTERMEDIATE - To take an intermediate class, you should know how to fold a bird base from memory, and be good at inside reverse folds, outside reverse folds, and sink folds.
HIGH INTERMEDIATE - To take a high intermediate class, you should be comfortable folding double rabbit ears, crimps, double open sinks and stretching a bird base.
COMPLEX - To take a complex class you should be an experienced folder, be able to do all the types of folds mentioned in the intermediate levels, be comfortable folding from diagrams, and be able to follow intricate sequences of precise moves.
Also, keep in mind the types of models you are familiar with and let that guide you. For example, you might be at the complex level for modulars, but an intermediate level for animals.
SIMPLE - Simple classes can be taken by anyone, even if you have never folded before.
LOW INTERMEDIATE - These classes are for folders who have done some folding, know some terminology and can do an inside reverse fold.
INTERMEDIATE - To take an intermediate class, you should know how to fold a bird base from memory, and be good at inside reverse folds, outside reverse folds, and sink folds.
HIGH INTERMEDIATE - To take a high intermediate class, you should be comfortable folding double rabbit ears, crimps, double open sinks and stretching a bird base.
COMPLEX - To take a complex class you should be an experienced folder, be able to do all the types of folds mentioned in the intermediate levels, be comfortable folding from diagrams, and be able to follow intricate sequences of precise moves.
Also, keep in mind the types of models you are familiar with and let that guide you. For example, you might be at the complex level for modulars, but an intermediate level for animals.
- Jonnycakes
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Those look like the standard definitions... from the Origami Conference ?
I personally would say that comfort with a closed sink might push to complex level, but that's just me being contrary.
Note that there are no levels for CP folding... and I don't know if an expert CP folder is necessarily a complex folder ?
Also, there are no levels for designers... and a good folder is not necessarily a good designer (and double ditto with diagramming).
Having said that ...there are even levels in the statosphere above complex... rather than trying to quantify all the grand masters, let me misquote Robert Lang: He said something like after he creates and takes hours to fold one of his intricate designs, he is humbled when Brian Chan folds the model faster, better, neater, and more realistically.
That's way over my definition of super-complex !
Anyone who remembers the quote, feel free to fix mine...
- Hank Simon
I personally would say that comfort with a closed sink might push to complex level, but that's just me being contrary.
Note that there are no levels for CP folding... and I don't know if an expert CP folder is necessarily a complex folder ?
Also, there are no levels for designers... and a good folder is not necessarily a good designer (and double ditto with diagramming).
Having said that ...there are even levels in the statosphere above complex... rather than trying to quantify all the grand masters, let me misquote Robert Lang: He said something like after he creates and takes hours to fold one of his intricate designs, he is humbled when Brian Chan folds the model faster, better, neater, and more realistically.
That's way over my definition of super-complex !
Anyone who remembers the quote, feel free to fix mine...
- Hank Simon
I'd have to say that the same terms apply to CPs, and that a CP folder is usually at least slightly more advance than someone not being able to fold a CP. Designers, too, have the same levels. After all, who creates the complex models? A designer with that ability, of course.
I wouldn't say that the complexity of models is quite that simple. Isn't a rabbit ear a lot easier than an open sink or closed sink? But I guess that that works well for naming the complexity of the classes...
Speed is something that differs a lot between folders, but it doesn't really matter how fast you fold as long as you fold precisely.
I wouldn't say that the complexity of models is quite that simple. Isn't a rabbit ear a lot easier than an open sink or closed sink? But I guess that that works well for naming the complexity of the classes...
Speed is something that differs a lot between folders, but it doesn't really matter how fast you fold as long as you fold precisely.
- unknownfolder
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Glad you think speed does not make you any better cupcake because sometimes I fold like my hands have weights attached to them. 30 pound weights.
I have to chime in on this. The true master folders have the ability to give their models life. They have that special artistic talent to make animals look like they are running, or in the case of some designers pooping (I recently folded a dog called pooper by Ronald Koh). Once you have folded for a few years or less you generally understand diagrams. Crease patterns look hard at first, but eventually you get the hang of it, but It takes years to and study of the models you design to truly get that touch of life.

I have to chime in on this. The true master folders have the ability to give their models life. They have that special artistic talent to make animals look like they are running, or in the case of some designers pooping (I recently folded a dog called pooper by Ronald Koh). Once you have folded for a few years or less you generally understand diagrams. Crease patterns look hard at first, but eventually you get the hang of it, but It takes years to and study of the models you design to truly get that touch of life.
Whenever I do complex Origami I get this sinking feeling.
- Jonnycakes
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I agree that CP folders tend to be able to fold more complex models than those that don't, but that might just be because CPs tend to be for very complex models anyway. I would not say that designers have levels like that-a complex model is not necessarily a well-designed one. A simple model can be much better-designed than a complex one. Complexity in the well-designedness and the artistry of a model is a moot point, since it does not directly affect either of them. Giang Dinh has some very simple models that are absolutely incredible, while I have seen many sloppy insects that don't achieve near the same affect.Cupcake wrote:I'd have to say that the same terms apply to CPs, and that a CP folder is usually at least slightly more advance than someone not being able to fold a CP. Designers, too, have the same levels. After all, who creates the complex models? A designer with that ability, of course.
Of course, that is not to say that it doesn't take skill to design a complex model. It is often harder with a more complex model to get everything to fit well into a design, so there is an increase in difficulty for designing more complex things. But simple designs have their own challenges, as well. In short, just because you can make something more complex doesn't mean you should, and just because someone folds simple forms does not mean that they can't fold complex ones.
- origamimasterjared
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Not quite. This is making the assumption that more complex equals better. If that were the case everyone would be worshipping Naoto Horiguchi instead of Satoshi Kamiya.Cupcake wrote:Designers, too, have the same levels. After all, who creates the complex models? A designer with that ability, of course.
For instance, I mainly focus on having a good clean appearance, and I also work with much less commonly approached subjects. I don't design insects much, not because I can't, but because they're boring and everyone is doing them. I've done a few insects, but I left them for the most part years ago. As far as I know, I was actually the original person to put claws on insect legs. (It was a Flying Atlas beetle, no less). I'd much rather do something like a prehistoric non-dinosaur (seriously when I heard that was the challenge I was ecstatic. I had been working on the Diplocaulus for some time.)
In my flickr album (way in the back) I have a couple examples of crazy-complex CPs that are absolutely in no way better than most of the less complex stuff.
Ahh, but I'm not saying that complex is better, just... harder. Complexity isn't really that important, the look of the final model is what is. Complexity doesn't mean that the model will look good or smooth. The way you fold it is what determines that. (Which is pretty much what has already been said)origamimasterjared wrote:Not quite. This is making the assumption that more complex equals better. If that were the case everyone would be worshipping Naoto Horiguchi instead of Satoshi Kamiya.Cupcake wrote:Designers, too, have the same levels. After all, who creates the complex models? A designer with that ability, of course.
For instance (using examples above) I find Giang Dinh's models amazing, and can only wish that I could get the curved organic nature of his models, but he isn't a complex designer. People like his models because of how they look instead of how many folds take to make them
- angrydemon
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There are no definite skill levels. Each designer has their own strengths and weaknesses. Some may be able to design ultra-complex models but have trouble breathing life into simpler models while some are the exact opposite. Anyway, giving 'skill levels' to people is like giving a monkey a flamethrower. Those with higher 'skill levels' will go around bragging and showing off, making fun of noobs of cause them to have low self esteem. Then they'll go binge eating or take drugs, or maybe even both. The end result is a rehab clinic full of fat, depressed, mentally disturbed origami folders. We don't want that now, do we?
Complex models aren't necessarily better. A good example may be Nathan Park's Vincent (sorry Nathan!). Anyway, he knows it isn't very well folded. This shows that models aren't better just because they cause more stress when you fold it. However, complex models ARE easier to shape then simple ones. Since all the details are already present, it only takes a few curved folds to complete them. Simple models have very plain and dull forms, meaning they require expert sculpting to breathe life into them.
I used to shun simple origami models and thought that complexity was everything, but that attitude changed after I bought Michael Lafosse's Advanced Origami. His book has really opened my mind to the possibilities of origami and taught me how to breathe life into models.
Complex models aren't necessarily better. A good example may be Nathan Park's Vincent (sorry Nathan!). Anyway, he knows it isn't very well folded. This shows that models aren't better just because they cause more stress when you fold it. However, complex models ARE easier to shape then simple ones. Since all the details are already present, it only takes a few curved folds to complete them. Simple models have very plain and dull forms, meaning they require expert sculpting to breathe life into them.
I used to shun simple origami models and thought that complexity was everything, but that attitude changed after I bought Michael Lafosse's Advanced Origami. His book has really opened my mind to the possibilities of origami and taught me how to breathe life into models.
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