Kawahata's Angel Playing A Lute

Place all non-origami related posts in here; films, food, your life etc.
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moonowl
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Kawahata's Angel Playing A Lute

Post by moonowl »

I don't have the out of print Tanteidan vol. 7. Is there anyone who knows of another source of the diagrams of this model? And no, I don't mean a CP.
I made an apple pie from instructions in a cookbook. Can I sell my pie? Of course. As long as I don't claim to be the creator of the recipe, I'm fine.Church bake sales are being sued? lol
bethnor
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Post by bethnor »

i'm pretty sure there isn't. and sadly, it seems kawahata has given up on publishing books with complex models and is going to content himself with releasing the occasional diagram.

lastly, the analogy of baking and origami is just not the same.
moonowl
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Post by moonowl »

In your opinion. I don't share it. If I ever publish a book, I wouldn't be so arrogant to think I had the ridiculously wayyyy beyond reasonable bounds Natzy- like control to think I could tell someone thay couldn't sell a model they made with their own materials and labor, simply because they folded it from my book. If someone spreads instructions to the world on how to fold a model, they shouldn't complain, unless the person falsely claims to have INVENTED the original design. If you don't agree, fine. I don't agree with you either. Thanks for the reply.
I made an apple pie from instructions in a cookbook. Can I sell my pie? Of course. As long as I don't claim to be the creator of the recipe, I'm fine.Church bake sales are being sued? lol
bethnor
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Post by bethnor »

moonowl wrote:In your opinion. I don't share it.
you misunderstand. you do what you wish with your time.

however, that does not change that your analogy is incorrect. a more correct analogy would be for me to take a recipe from, say, one of daniel boulud's books. maybe his famous burger, which he stuffs with truffles and sells for $75 a pop. i won't claim in my menu that i created it. unfortunately, a restaurant critic catches wind, and lets daniel know. from what i understand of boulud, i would then become the subject of his wrath. i am pretty sure i would get sued, and without knowing much of the law, i am pretty sure i would lose.

of course you can get a cookbook from a famous chef, make recipes from it, and sell it for profit... so long as you are not caught. but once you are, don't expect a silly analogy with apple pies to protect you.

a recipe like apple pie is public domain as there is no way to prove who that belongs to. but the boulud burger is very distinctive (much, as say, a satoshi kamiya ancient dragon is).

keep in mind that i am not arguing about your right to do anything. i don't care what you do. the only reason people can currently sell origami that they didn't create is because the law is hazy about the matter now. with the matter of sarah morris looming, that may change very soon and it won't matter what you or i think. i have my own opinion on the matter, but i haven't yet shared it on this forum, nor will i, given how incendiary it is.
moonowl
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Post by moonowl »

You misunderstand. I never said WHAT I did with my time. I stated my opinion of people trying to take the idea of copyright to ridiculous lengths. IMO their rights should only extend so far. And telling people they can't sell a model they made with their own hands is too far. I agree that the inventor should be given credit for the original design. I also agree that people that try to copy diagrams from a book shouldn't do it. But that's as far as it should go. As for designer burgers, if a chef doesn't want people to make his burgers and do what they like with the food they made, he shouldn't spread the recipe to the world in the first place. And if he does publish a cookbook, he already got all the money he should have from the book publisher. Have a nice day.
I made an apple pie from instructions in a cookbook. Can I sell my pie? Of course. As long as I don't claim to be the creator of the recipe, I'm fine.Church bake sales are being sued? lol
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Argil
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Post by Argil »

bethnor wrote: lastly, the analogy of baking and origami is just not the same.
I think a better analogy would be of origami and music. One is entitled to sing the songs of Michael Jackson under is shower, but not to make a disc and sell it.
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Ben385
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Post by Ben385 »

If Origami is an art form, then surely painting and sculpture are good comparisons. You can paint as many copies of the Mona Lisa as you want, but don't expect to be able to sell them....
Adam
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Post by Adam »

Ben385 wrote:If Origami is an art form, then surely painting and sculpture are good comparisons. You can paint as many copies of the Mona Lisa as you want, but don't expect to be able to sell them....
Wait, what? Of course you can sell those. It's called a reproduction, and it happens with tons of statues and paintings.

Also, let's lock this topic, since it's only becoming another copyright discussion!
nonkelgans
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Post by nonkelgans »

What copyright? the Tandeidan Book is long out of print so nobody is making any money with it except those who sell it for big $$ on the second hand market.

Like I posted (before it was deleted here), torrents exist for a reason, while I DO NOT advocate downloading books and diagrams that are still for sale I do believe it's another matter if books are long out of print (and have no prospect of ever being reprinted again). If you have to wait for one to come along you will probably have a long grey beard or already in your coffin. I often download things that are out of print and keep them on my harddrive until I find a real copy. After all, a real book is always nicer but alas sometimes it's impossible to get them due the rarity of some books.
bethnor
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Post by bethnor »

moonowl wrote:You misunderstand.
you still don't understand.

you can have your opinion on abortion. your opinion is your opinion and you have a right to it. but whatever you feel about it, it is legal in the united states.

if you are caught making a profit from another chef's recipe, i am fairly certain you will lose under the letter of the law if you are caught. you can think that's silly all you want. i don't care how you feel about it. it may be that i feel the exact same way. but that doesn't change the law on the matter.

if things haven't already, the sarah morris matter will come to a head. if the US decides to afford legal protections to the resale of cps, that will set a precedant that will likely extend to finished models. you can go ahead and think that's silly. it may be that i do, too (i haven't said). but there will still be laws on the matter, which are distinct from your (and my) opinion(s).

have a nice day.
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